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Start Previous [ 1 ] -- 2 -- Next End| Topic: Is Ukraine a lost cause? |
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| 1. Author: OzPar Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 02:17 I know this isn’t a popular viewpoint, but I say: thank God for Vladimir Putin. He may be ruthless, but he is intelligent and not impulsive. Without him, we would likely already be in World War III. We may still face that nightmare, but for now, it is his measured responses to increasingly reckless demands from Europe and the UK over Ukraine that have kept it at bay. Even Donald Trump now openly accepts the inevitable—Russia has won. Since the failed Ukrainian counteroffensive in 2023, the outcome has been clear. Militarily, the war ended then. Yet for reasons that seem less about defence and more about political convenience and corruption, Western leaders and a compliant media insisted on the opposite. At the same time, NATO leaders thumped the table, demanding a “firm response” to Russia while knowing full well that without the United States, NATO lacks the forces or the ammunition for a protracted conflict with a battle-hardened Russia. America’s attention has moved: to the Middle East, to Venezuela, and ultimately to China. Washington cannot fight effectively on multiple fronts, so responsibility for NATO has drifted back to Europe, whose governments can neither afford nor politically sustain the military budgets required. Stealing Russian assets frozen in European banks? That will backfire. Raising defence spending while cutting domestic programs? That will backfire, too. It’s hard to see Macron, Merz, or Starmer surviving the political cost for long. So why does NATO keep pushing to prolong the war? Vast sums of public money are being siphoned into the conflict, and through various bait-and-switch schemes, are being presented as unwavering support for Ukraine. Western promises have repeatedly been loud upfront, while actual deliveries have been slow, restricted, or diluted. Russian soldiers report finding Ukrainian units armed with WWII-era rifles. Where, then, is the money going? Corruption. It’s worth remembering that Russia and Ukraine had the outlines of a peace agreement within a month of the invasion. In late March 2022, Ukraine offered neutrality — no NATO membership and no foreign bases — in exchange for binding security guarantees. Moscow signalled it might accept a framework that didn’t demand total Ukrainian capitulation. It wasn’t a done deal, but diplomacy appeared possible. Then came Bucha. The atrocities hardened Ukrainian attitudes. And in mid-April, Boris Johnson told Zelensky that even if Ukraine was ready to sign, the Western powers were not. Three and a half years later, with perhaps two million dead, we are left with corrupt politicians still lining their pockets with public money while demanding that more Ukrainians and Russians die for a lost cause. Reply |
| 2. Author: P Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 08:12 And then after splooging all over himself while writing that Oz cleaned himself up and went to sleep The End Reply |
| 3. Author: hurricane_jimmy Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 08:31 Australian security services need to do a thorough audit of this guy`s contacts and bank accounts methinks! 😂 Reply |
| 4. Author: Bletchley_Par Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 08:45 Ukraine are running out of men to send to the meatgrinder, they are losing.  Reply |
| 5. Author: hurricane_jimmy Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 08:54 You could always head off and help the Ruscists out Bletchley if you think that - Turkish Airlines are still flying there and had some cracking Black Friday deals to and from Edinburgh. Should be easy work for Trumpians like yourself, no? Reply |
| 6. Author: Bletchley_Par Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 09:04 "If I think that". I think that not because I wish to "help Russia", I think it simply because it is the reality of the situation and has been for some time now. Reply |
| 7. Author: hurricane_jimmy Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 09:33 Same thing your lot have been saying for years...so when will Ukraine fold? Reply |
| 8. Author: Bletchley_Par Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 10:41 I think it was around 2023.  Post Edited (Sun 30 Nov 10:42) Reply |
| 9. Author: jake89 Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 11:23 Wealthy people playing war with the lives of poor people. We can debate who is right/wrong all day long but in the meantime.more and more people die in a largely needless war. Reply |
| 10. Author: ipswichpar Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 12:13 Keep off the 4X Oz Reply |
| 11. Author: hurricane_jimmy Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 13:13 Not sure the Ukrainians would agree with you there Jake: they`re quite ready for peace, but not at any cost. I would agree with you that the war is needless, but from the perspective that it was a plot for Putin to distract the masses from the growing anti-corruption sentiment. With the resources Russia has, it should be doing far better economically, yet the likes of Poland do it to shame. Why? Because the money is disappearing into the Oligarchy`s pockets. Bletchley, anyone can post a table but it would be handy to know the source and to see something comparable from the Russian side, which is conspicuously always missing from your poats on this topic. Russian casualties are currently about 3x those of the Ukraine and the mortality rate is much higher in the Russian side, simply because they don`t value their soldiers` lives. Then you have all the mercenaries from Kenya, Nepal and elsewhere because Putin is scared to recruit from ethnically Russian families, particularly in the Moscow-Peterburg bubble. Did you not notice how he bricked it the minute Tomohawk missiles were mentioned and got on the phone to his plant in the white house? The war could end with Putin simply withdrawing, which we all know he won`t do because this would cost him his power and, most likely, his life. Reply |
| 12. Author: jake89 Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 13:33 Weird how someone was probably an inch away from killing Trump yet no-one`s managed to take Putin. Neither side fills itself with glory but obviously the issue starts and ends with Russia and Putin. He can`t seem to back down so needs offered something but the longer it goes on the bigger that something needs to be. Reply |
| 13. Author: Bletchley_Par Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 17:16
I said this 9 months ago on the Trump thread. Topic Originator: Bletchley_Par Date: Fri 28 Feb 23:32 And the solid brutal truth is this....Ukraine are killing Russians at a higher rate than the Russians are killing Ukrainians, they are fighting the good fight....but it`s not enough, they will run out of men to feed the meat grinder. Then you have all the mercenaries from Kenya, Nepal and elsewhere because Putin is scared to recruit from ethnically Russian families, particularly in the Moscow-Peterburg bubble. Did you not notice how he bricked it the minute Tomohawk missiles were mentioned and got on the phone to his plant in the white house? Not sure how him using battle-hardend mercenaries rather than a conscripted civilian is a disadvantage tbh. The war could end with Putin simply withdrawing, which we all know he won`t do because this would cost him his power and, most likely, his life. Are there any people posting here who don`t think that? Reply |
| 14. Author: hurricane_jimmy Date: Sun 30th Nov 2025. 23:37 "Battle-hardened mercenaries" is a stretch to say the least: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/11/8/ukraines-fm-says-over-1400-africans-recruited-to-fight-for-russia-in-war You do have folk like Oz saying "thank God for Vladimir Putin" and who has previously stated that "Ukraine should surrender" and claiming Zelensky is a con-man etc. Funny thing is, you can bet there`ll be very little knowledge of the staged apartment bombings that were used to launch the war in oil-rich Chechnya or of the fact that Putin headed several investigations into corruption in the late 90s that got him into a position where he could effectively blackmail Yeltsin, whom he just happened to grant immunity before taking office himself...but yeah, Zelensky is the conman right enough! Reply |
| 15. Author: Bletchley_Par Date: Mon 1st Dec 2025. 03:38 Jimmy I get the impression you are going to great lengths in an attempt to get me to call Putin a *the c word. Would that be a fair assessment of where this discussion is at? * Edited due to the swear filter being a flower. Post Edited (Mon 01 Dec 03:40) Reply |
| 16. Author: hurricane_jimmy Date: Mon 1st Dec 2025. 19:59 Why not just share your opinion? Or are you afraid to show your true colours? Reply |
| 17. Author: Back_oh_the_net Date: Wed 3rd Dec 2025. 22:15 ipswichpar, Sun 30 Nov 12:13 He’s graduated from 4X to Crystal Meth by the looks of it Reply |
| 18. Author: OzPar Date: Wed 3rd Dec 2025. 22:34 What a sad state of affairs that people can come on here and insult you in quite vicious and offensive ways when all you have done in is express opinions that are quite common outside of the UK and EU. Reply |
| 19. Author: Dandy Warhol Date: Thu 4th Dec 2025. 08:36 OzPar, Wed 3 Dec 22:34 .Net doesn`t like people who don`t furiously virtue signal, you have to play the citizen card round these parts. I don`t wanna go down like disco. Reply |
| 20. Author: ipswichpar Date: Thu 4th Dec 2025. 09:03 Dandy Warhol, Thu 4 Dec 08:36 Write the opposite of the original post on a site in Russia and perhaps you will realise it is a nonsense argument. Reply |
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